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copied this from another board.

  • meyerkids said...

    Author said do with it what we want.

    It is a great compilation of stats etc.

    As we approach the end of Bo Pelini's fifth year at Nebraska and head into another winter filled with questions, anguish and a number of tragically predictable outcomes on the horizon, I thought it might be interesting to take a quantitative look at why some Husker fans (like myself) are so frustrated by the current state of our program. I'll do my best to be brief in my analysis, instead focusing on the numbers themselves to tell the story.

    Some of the statistics will be good, some will be bad and some will provide more questions than answers. By the end, though, I believe they will tell a story that should provide a bit of context as to why fans like myself believe Nebraska is at a dangerous and not altogether impressive plateau.

    Wins/losses, etc Overall record: 48-19 (.716) Conference record: 29-11 (.725) Overall record vs. BCS opponents: 33-19 (.634) Win/loss record vs BCS opponents from Aug 2008 to Kansas 2010: 19-9 (.678) Win/loss record vs BCS opponents since Texas aTm 2010* to present: 14-10 (.583) Bowl record: 2-2 Most wins in a season: 10 Fewest wins in a season: 9 Most losses in a season: 4 Fewest losses in a season: 3

    (*Rather than being an arbitrary date, the aTm game was selected because it seemed to be the game where a major change occurred in the trajectory of the program. One could argue that the loss, coupled with the distractions caused by both Pelinis, along with the subsequent losses at the end of the year marked a significant change in the course of the program)

    Rankings Year by year final poll position (highest): unranked, 14th, 19th, 24th, unranked (pending bowl outcome) Highest ranking achieved: 5th - prior to 2010 loss to Texas Highest rank in 2012: 12th Currently: 16th pending outcome of Cap One Bowl

    Offense - year end rankings 2008 - 12th total offense, 17th scoring offense 2009 - 72nd total offense, 73rd scoring offense 2010 - 44th total offense, 38th scoring offense 2011 - 66th total offense, 50th scoring offense 2012 YTD - 25th total offense, 29th scoring offense

    Defense - year end rankings 2008 - 55th total defense, 81st scoring defense 2009 - 7th total defense, 1st scoring defense 2010 - 11th total defense, 9th scoring defense 2011 - 37th total defense, 42 scoring defense 2012 - 22nd total defense, 56th scoring defense

    Recruiting Rankings (2008 excluded due to staff change) 2009 - 28th 2010 - 22nd 2011 - 15th 2012 - 25th 2013 YTD - 43rd Average finish - 26th

    Bowl appearances 2008 Gator Bowl (W) 2009 Holiday Bowl (W) 2010 Holiday Bowl (L) 2011 Capital One Bowl (L) 2012 Capital One Bowl (TBD) (*No BCS bowl berths)

    Big Games 8-10 vs. ranked opponents (.444) No seasons of record over .500 vs ranked opponents (best record - 3-3) Wins vs. Top 15: #12 PSU (2011), #9 MSU (2011), #7 Mizzou (2010) Overall record vs Top 15: 3-8 (.272)

    Hardware/trophies 2008 Gator Bowl 2009 Big XII North championship 2009 Holiday Bowl 2010 Big XII North championship 2012 Big Ten Legends division championship (*No conference championships)

    In great company - consistent performances Since 2008, only four teams have won 9 game each year: Nebraska, Oregon, Boise State and Alabama Combined BCS appearances: 9 Combined national championship game appearances: 4 BCS appearances by Nebraska: 0 National championship appearances by Nebraska: 0

    Blowouts - a troubling trend 8 losses by 17 or more points Average margin of defeat in blowout losses - Opponents 50 - Nebraska 21 Average blowouts per year: 1.6 Number of times opponents scored 40 or more in blowouts - 6 (4 since 2011) Number of times opponents scored 60 or more in blowouts - 3 (2 in 2012) Nationally televised blowouts by 17 or more points: 7 (TTU in 2009 was ABC regional)

    Some will suggest that these numbers don't tell the whole story - that there's a qualitative aspect that's not being taken into account. Or that numbers like Academic All Americans add in another dimension. Perhaps they do. I would simply counter with a question: if you had been told back in January of 2008 that following the conclusion of year 5 of the Bo Pelini era we would have no conference championships, no BCS appearances, no 11 win seasons, no top 10 finishes, no top 10 recruiting finishes, and a spate of nasty losses on national television to peer programs, would you have been happy with the hire? If you had been told in January of 2008 that the momentum of our program would peak in 2009, would you have been happy? As fans of the fourth winningest program of all time, I would hope the answer would be no

    ,,,same old thread; classic revisionism. 'Am depressed not impressed; 'am not interested!

    This post has been edited 3 times, most recently by Khoolshady on 12/18/2012 at 7:51 PM

    Khoolshady ●

  • MikeCaramba said...

    Ha! I'm glad you liked my "facts".

    I suppose Exhibit A would be the 2003 coaching search. People like to blame the AD, but the fact remains we were two years removed from a NC appearance and still had to go way down our list of coaching targets. After that, I'd point to the (relative) quality of Nebraska high school football. Then the large geographical void between us and the closest recruiting hotbeds. Then the disparity in staff salaries between us and the top-level programs. Then probably the fact that two of our last three coaches (again, if Pelini were fired after this year) were let go after ten-win season -- that's the definition of instability.

    Please, please don't take that the wrong way. First of all, it's only my opinion. Second of all, even though I don't regard Nebraska as a top-ten coaching destination, I absolutely regard it as the best -- and my favorite -- football program in the country. However, it's clear to me that coaching at Nebraska is an extremely difficult task -- not the kind you take on when you have nothing left to prove. However, it presents a great opportunity for an up-and-coming coach or coordinator to become a legend. That's why I think any future coaching hires will require good doses of risk and patience, rather than (again, my opinion) futile attempts to "buy" our next great dynasty.

    Lot of misinformation in this thread. Understandable, a lot of its been circulating for years. 2 actual facts I would like to point out, one observation, then ya'll can carry on as you see fit:

    1 Pedey absolutely IS the reason the coaching search in 03 turned into such a joke. I've told many on this board this before, but he absolutely had Urb until he let his ego get in the way. After that got out, and he continued on his one man mission, things went down hill fast.

    2 In 07, TO got down to a final 2 of Turner and Bo by choice, not by necessity. Then Turner removed his name to save his friend and mentor some serious anxiety and wah lah, here's Bo. Had TO been willing to open the checkbook, both Schiano and Kelly were serious options. Among others.

    I realize where Nebraska ranks in terms of destination jobs is going to vary amongst posters on here. But everyone needs to realize they vary amongst coaches, too. There are more outstanding coaches out there that would love to coach here if the money was right than many are seemingly willing to give us credit for. And their opinions are the only ones that really matter.

    This post was edited by Big Red Phoenix on 12/18/2012 at 10:33 PM

    Big Red Phoenix

  • this thread bores me

    klein12

  • Big Red Phoenix said...

    Lot of misinformation in this thread. Understandable, a lot of its been circulating for years. 2 actual facts I would like to point out, one observation, then ya'll can carry on as you see fit:

    1 Pedey absolutely IS the reason the coaching search in 03 turned into such a joke. I've told many on this board this before, but he absolutely had Urb until he let his ego get in the way. After that got out, and he continued on his one man mission, things went down hill fast.

    2 In 07, TO got down to a final 2 of Turner and Bo by choice, not by necessity. Then Turner removed his name to save his friend and mentor some serious anxiety and wah lah, here's Bo. Had TO been willing to open the checkbook, both Schiano and Kelly were serious options. Among others.

    I realize where Nebraska ranks in terms of destination jobs is going to vary amongst posters on here. But everyone needs to realize they vary amongst coaches, too. There are more outstanding coaches out there that would love to coach here if the money was right than many are seemingly willing to give us credit for. And their opinions are the only ones that really matter.

    I like what you have to say here. I believe NU is a premier job and good many coaches would jump at it.

    NU Big Lou ●

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  • klein12 said...

    this thread bores me

    Sorry.

    MikeCaramba

  • MikeCaramba said...

    Sorry.

    biggrin

    klein12

  • meyerkids said...

    For starters, while I appreciate your concerns, I only copied and pasted so I personally didn't take more than 2 seconds to put this together

    Second, monkey puke and pig crap is high end stuff

    Three, 48 wins in 5 years is meaningless when you can't win a meaningful game, beat a team with a heartbeat, or finish inside the top 15. whoopty bleeping do

    Four, when your best teams are with the previous coaches players and 5 years in your talent level has gone down, that is a sure sign that you are not succeeding at your job.

    Five, getting to the CCG in one of the bottom conferences in the BCS and then getting pasted 70-17 by the 3rd place team, I mean 70-31. I forgot about the last 2 touchdowns when our starters finally did something against Wisky's #2's

    Six, when you have to resort to bashing someone with a differing opinion, or blindly looking past statistical information because what you see scares you, then we are in a bad state.

    You all have your opinions. You are Husker fans through and through. I have mine, and it doesn't make me any less of a husker fan. I love the Huskers, I just don't think our coach deserves his job. When you are paid 3 million plus a year and you are earning about a third of that, then we have problems. Pelini's success or lack thereof would not fly in any normal, results oriented business. It shouldn't fly hear. He can't win a big game. Out of his own mouth he has stated he doesn't know how to fix the problems at hand. He doesn't recruit well enough to compete with the best teams in the country. he doesn't develop players.

    I am sick of the 9 or 10 win excuse. Thank the Lord we play in a conference without a pulse. Can you imagine what the discussions would be today if we actually had to play more than 1 or 2 real teams in our conference. It would be down right awful.

    So take your monkey puke, and pig crap, put it in your pipe and smoke it. Take the blinders off. or dont. go ahead and continue to be completely content with 9-4 or 10-3 records with 2/3 of your losses being total ass kickings in front of a National Audience.

    .. I'll say it definitely isn't the data that I find scary. Your interpretation of it though is really just silly and in that sense it is a little scary to have you spouting off as a fan of Husker football. Normally something this silly/stupid would be in a way amusing but I can't say I'm amused. I suppose because I do think posting this type of 'support' for the program in the middle of recruiting season is the type of dead weight our coaches shouldn't have to overcome from the fan base.

    So how do I really feel - I think somewhere between disgusted and now very bored would be about right. But you put a lot of effort into this post and you are defintely entitled to your opinion and can air it anywhere they will have you. I suspect it is even possible fans of other teams may be pasting this onto their sites as well - so congratulations..

    I guess that 48 wins in five seasons, five consecutive bowl appearances and resurecting a very troubled and downward trending program in very short order merits the coach being demeaned and then fired in your world. Good luck with that outlook because if the NU administration adopts it we will very likely be going through a whole lot of new coaches in the next few decades. And it will be taking longer and longer for any of them to get to those 48 "meaningless" wins.

    .

  • Big Red Phoenix said...

    Lot of misinformation in this thread. Understandable, a lot of its been circulating for years. 2 actual facts I would like to point out, one observation, then ya'll can carry on as you see fit:

    1 Pedey absolutely IS the reason the coaching search in 03 turned into such a joke. I've told many on this board this before, but he absolutely had Urb until he let his ego get in the way. After that got out, and he continued on his one man mission, things went down hill fast.

    2 In 07, TO got down to a final 2 of Turner and Bo by choice, not by necessity. Then Turner removed his name to save his friend and mentor some serious anxiety and wah lah, here's Bo. Had TO been willing to open the checkbook, both Schiano and Kelly were serious options. Among others.

    I realize where Nebraska ranks in terms of destination jobs is going to vary amongst posters on here. But everyone needs to realize they vary amongst coaches, too. There are more outstanding coaches out there that would love to coach here if the money was right than many are seemingly willing to give us credit for. And their opinions are the only ones that really matter.

    1. A guy with three years of coaching experience at sub-BCS programs with one top-25 finish (21st).

    2. A guy with one top-25 finish in 7 years at the BCS level, coming off an 8-5 year. And a guy with one year of FBS coaching experience.

    You just made my point for me. No doubt Urb or Kelly would have been great hires, but at the times in question, they certainly weren't known quantities.

    I don't know why my comments have been taken to mean, "we need to hire poor coaches." I'm saying we need to take risks on (relatively) inexperienced coaches -- like the ones you cited -- give them time to build something, and hope for the best.

    EDIT: I see that I said "coordinator" in the post you quoted. My bad. Should read "up-and-coming coordinator/coach" -- don't think we need to restrict our search to coordinators, nor do I think we should exclude them.

    This post was edited by MikeCaramba on 12/18/2012 at 11:40 PM

    MikeCaramba

  • klein12 said...

    biggrin

    I laughed at "this thread bores me" biggrin

    MikeCaramba

  • NEB_MERCY1 said...

    .. I'll say it definitely isn't the data that I find scary. Your interpretation of it though is really just silly and in that sense it is a little scary to have you spouting off as a fan of Husker football. Normally something this silly/stupid would be in a way amusing but I can't say I'm amused. I suppose because I do think posting this type of 'support' for the program in the middle of recruiting season is the type of dead weight our coaches shouldn't have to overcome from the fan base.

    So how do I really feel - I think somewhere between disgusted and now very bored would be about right. But you put a lot of effort into this post and you are defintely entitled to your opinion and can air it anywhere they will have you. I suspect it is even possible fans of other teams may be pasting this onto their sites as well - so congratulations..

    I guess that 48 wins in five seasons, five consecutive bowl appearances and resurecting a very troubled and downward trending program in very short order merits the coach being demeaned and then fired in your world. Good luck with that outlook because if the NU administration adopts it we will very likely be going through a whole lot of new coaches in the next few decades. And it will be taking longer and longer for any of them to get to those 48 "meaningless" wins.

    .

    And I find it extremely disturbing that a true Husker fan is hanging his hat on 48 wins in 5 years when none of them are wins that mattered. None of them are wins that make a recruit say, hmmmmmmmmmm NU is a place I wanna go.

    You feel that my "spouting off" has a negative effect on recruiting, well I feel that getting your ass handed to you 70-17(34) and 63 to whatever it was, and giving up 6billion yards to UCLA, or last year getting crushed at Wisky and Michigan, etc. etc., etc. has WAY MORE negative effects on recruiting than my being pissed about things.

    I wish I had that much effect on things but somehow I just don't see it. What I do see is continuous ass-kickings against good teams, loss after loss in meaningful games, records being set that surpass Cosgrove, piss-poor recruiting in years past leading us to the aforementioned results, which are all the main reasons why we don't recruit well and aren't succeeding.

    9-4 10-3 as we are year in and year out now is akin to teams of the Osborne era being 7-3, 8-3 etc. We get 2 more games these days and 1 will always be against the sisters of the poor.

    i really could care less what our record is, the bigger deal is how would we stack up against the best teams out there. I know Osborne lost a lot of games to top teams for a long period but he wasn't getting embarrassed while losing.

    Bama, LSU, Oregon, ND, Fla, Fla st, Clemson, Georgia, South Carolina, OU, K-State, A&M, tOSU

    I would say these are the top teams in the country this year. How do we stack up. There isn't one win there, and of the 13 games there is most likely 6 absolute ass-whoopings.

    woohoo, 48 wins, until we can compete with the best teams in the country those wins don't mean anything

    meyerkids

  • MikeCaramba said...

    1. A guy with three years of coaching experience at sub-BCS programs with one top-25 finish (21st).

    2. A guy with one top-25 finish in 7 years at the BCS level, coming off an 8-5 year. And a guy with one year of FBS coaching experience.

    You just made my point for me. No doubt Urb or Kelly would have been great hires, but at the times in question, they certainly weren't known quantities.

    I don't know why my comments have been taken to mean, "we need to hire poor coaches." I'm saying we need to take risks on (relatively) inexperienced coaches -- like the ones you cited -- give them time to build something, and hope for the best.

    EDIT: I see that I said "coordinator" in the post you quoted. My bad. Should read "up-and-coming coordinator/coach" -- don't think we need to restrict our search to coordinators, nor do I think we should exclude them.

    If you think I made your point for you, then you are confused on what everyone else's point is. Whether you want to agree with it or not, the guys that we had at the top of our lists in each situation were THE most coveted young coaches in all of college football at the time. I listed the examples I did because of the success they've had since then. Urb was hired by Florida 1 season after Nebraska ended it's search. Does Florida have to "limit" itself in it's coaching searches, as you suggested we do? Brian Kelly went to Notre Dame 2 years later. Are they a "top 10" program in your eyes? Because they are in everyone else's. Did that extra season at Cincinnati make all the difference? Schiano parlayed his Rutgers gig into an NFL HC job.

    I don't know if you think everyone's hoping we get rid of Bo so we can go out and hire some 60 yr old re-tred that used to coach championship games, but these young, up and coming coaches are who the good schools go after nowadays.

    Big Red Phoenix

  • So you are stating that you wanted Urban Meyer or Brian Kelly to be hired at Nebraska?

    How can you say that in retrospect?

    I don't want either of the POS coaching our program. One is a fraudulent cheater, and the other is responsible for the death of kid at his school. I understand Urban was a good hire at the time you suggest, but looking back i'd bet our program would be suspected of cheating...BIG TIME. With Kelly i disagree though, he was not the answer for problems we had at the time.

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    beardown2489

  • we are stuck at 25------

    as indicated by the analysis above (Bill Parcells indicated "you are your record"), we are stuck at around 25, rankings, recruiting, results against the big guys (25th ranked teams can beat 10-25, but very seldom the big guys a 1-9), and quality of staff (lack a killer closer)

    I am not so concerned about the above, but the trajectory. are we getting better? I don't think so, but I hope that recruiting final results and the GA game prove me wrong--if GA is only favored by 10 at gametime, I think that they cover easily--

    GBR

    eastcobbhuskerd

  • beardown2489 said...

    So you are stating that you wanted Urban Meyer or Brian Kelly to be hired at Nebraska?

    How can you say that in retrospect?

    I don't want either of the POS coaching our program. One is a fraudulent cheater, and the other is responsible for the death of kid at his school. I understand Urban was a good hire at the time you suggest, but looking back i'd bet our program would be suspected of cheating...BIG TIME. With Kelly i disagree though, he was not the answer for problems we had at the time.

    Somebody help me out here. Apparently I'm not doing a very good job...

    Big Red Phoenix

  • Big Red Phoenix said...

    If you think I made your point for you, then you are confused on what everyone else's point is. Whether you want to agree with it or not, the guys that we had at the top of our lists in each situation were THE most coveted young coaches in all of college football at the time. I listed the examples I did because of the success they've had since then. Urb was hired by Florida 1 season after Nebraska ended it's search. Does Florida have to "limit" itself in it's coaching searches, as you suggested we do? Brian Kelly went to Notre Dame 2 years later. Are they a "top 10" program in your eyes? Because they are in everyone else's. Did that extra season at Cincinnati make all the difference? Schiano parlayed his Rutgers gig into an NFL HC job.

    I don't know if you think everyone's hoping we get rid of Bo so we can go out and hire some 60 yr old re-tred that used to coach championship games, but these young, up and coming coaches are who the good schools go after nowadays.

    Yes, one year made a difference with Urban Meyer. He went undefeated and had a top-5 finish. That raised his stock.

    Yes, two years made a difference with Brian Kelly. He won the Big East for the first time the next year, then had an undefeated top-5 finish the next year. That raised his stock.

    No, I'm not suggesting people think we should go for 60yo re-treds. I'm suggesting that *some* people (not necessarily you) think if we fire Bo, we can just throw $5M a year at Chris Petersen, Chip Kelly, or whoever, and they'll come. I don't see that happening. Petersen today does not = Urb ca. 2003. C. Kelly today does not = B. Kelly ca. 2007. If you're suggesting we go for top up-and-comers (a term I used multiple times in previous posts), then we're clearly on the same page, no further argument necessary.

    This post was edited by MikeCaramba on 12/19/2012 at 3:37 PM

    MikeCaramba

  • MikeCaramba said...

    Yes, one year made a difference with Urban Meyer. He went undefeated and had a top-5 finish. That raised his stock.

    Yes, two years made a difference with Brian Kelly. He won the Big East for the first time the next year, then had an undefeated top-5 finish the next year. That raised his stock.

    No, I'm not suggesting people think we should go for 60yo re-treds. I'm suggesting that *some* people (not necessarily you) think if we fire Bo, we can just throw $5M a year at Chris Petersen, Chip Kelly, or whoever, and they'll come. I don't see that happening. Petersen today does not = Urb ca. 2003. C. Kelly today does not = B. Kelly ca. 2007. If you're suggesting we go for top up-and-comers (a term I used multiple times in previous posts), then we're clearly on the same page, no further argument necessary.

    If you think Chip Kelly and Chris Petersen are on the same level, we are not on the same page. But still, no further argument necessary.

    Big Red Phoenix

  • Big Red Phoenix said...

    If you think Chip Kelly and Chris Petersen are on the same level, we are not on the same page. But still, no further argument necessary.

    Kind of stretching for a point of contention, aren't you? Rabble rabble rabble. Good day, sir.

    This post has been edited 3 times, most recently by MikeCaramba on 12/19/2012 at 4:37 PM

    MikeCaramba

  • Lots of long posts in this thread.

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    BornToBeRed

  • Man you have alot of time on your hands.

    NU Anthony

  • NU Anthony said...

    Man you have alot of time on your hands.

    this thread is exhausting.

    klein12

  • meyerkids said...

    For starters, while I appreciate your concerns, I only copied and pasted so I personally didn't take more than 2 seconds to put this together

    Second, monkey puke and pig crap is high end stuff

    Three, 48 wins in 5 years is meaningless when you can't win a meaningful game, beat a team with a heartbeat, or finish inside the top 15. whoopty bleeping do

    Four, when your best teams are with the previous coaches players and 5 years in your talent level has gone down, that is a sure sign that you are not succeeding at your job.

    Five, getting to the CCG in one of the bottom conferences in the BCS and then getting pasted 70-17 by the 3rd place team, I mean 70-31. I forgot about the last 2 touchdowns when our starters finally did something against Wisky's #2's

    Six, when you have to resort to bashing someone with a differing opinion, or blindly looking past statistical information because what you see scares you, then we are in a bad state.

    You all have your opinions. You are Husker fans through and through. I have mine, and it doesn't make me any less of a husker fan. I love the Huskers, I just don't think our coach deserves his job. When you are paid 3 million plus a year and you are earning about a third of that, then we have problems. Pelini's success or lack thereof would not fly in any normal, results oriented business. It shouldn't fly hear. He can't win a big game. Out of his own mouth he has stated he doesn't know how to fix the problems at hand. He doesn't recruit well enough to compete with the best teams in the country. he doesn't develop players.

    I am sick of the 9 or 10 win excuse. Thank the Lord we play in a conference without a pulse. Can you imagine what the discussions would be today if we actually had to play more than 1 or 2 real teams in our conference. It would be down right awful.

    So take your monkey puke, and pig crap, put it in your pipe and smoke it. Take the blinders off. or dont. go ahead and continue to be completely content with 9-4 or 10-3 records with 2/3 of your losses being total ass kickings in front of a National Audience.

    clap

    Standing ovation.

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    A NovaNoles Design

    Humble Warrior ●

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  • MikeCaramba said...

    Kind of stretching for a point of contention, aren't you? Rabble rabble rabble. Good day, sir.

    No, I'm not stretching. You, among others, are trying to claim that we couldn't get a top tier coach if Bo left. I'm telling you that each of our last two coaching searches, we had legitimate interest from the most sought-after coaching prospects in the country. What you, or anyone else on this message board, thinks of those prospects doesn't disprove that fact. No, we couldn't go out and get Nick Saban or Urban Meyer anymore. But there are DOZENS of quality coaches out there that would love to come to Nebraska.

    Chip Kelly coaches one of the top programs in the country, in one of the top conferences in the country, a BCS conference. Petersen coaches at Boise State. You made a ridiculous comparison, whether you realize it or not.

    Big Red Phoenix

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