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Is this the same feeling Western Kentucky gets when they finalize their recruiting class? Why in the name of all that is holy can we not land a couple big time DTs? Speechless.
Oh not again....
Goal in life is to make the Huskers Illustrated Hall Of Fame
Why we certainly have missed out this year, Nebraska has rarely recruited big time DT's from outside the immediate area.
We've recruited 6 All American DT's in the last 43 years that weren't from Nebraska or a border state. If the talent we need isn't available locally, we don't often get it, and that's been going on for decades not just lately.
Some are convinced that have routinely brought these kind of guys in over the years and that is simply not the case. If they didn't grow up in our backyard, we haven't typically gotten them.
I'd like to see us get a few top dogs from elsewhere in the country too, but the fact that we haven't isn't the least bit unusual based on what's happened the past 40+ years under 5 different coaches.
You're obviously in sales.
You're obviously someone who hasn't paid much attention to how we've recruited the past 50 years.
maybe we find the next JJ Watt. There are lots of big name DTs that never amount to much of anything. Wan't Todd Peat a 4* guy? That worked out well. Whining about not getting a big name DT is a dead horse but please keep on kicking it.
And Alabama has recruited 4 All-American DT's in the last 43 years.
Texas has recruited 7 All-American DT's in the last 43 years.
Okalhoma has recruited 7 All-American DT's in the last 43 years.
And Nebraska has recruited 11 All-American DT's in the last 43 years.
I agree, it's beating a dead horse. I just wish the people who keep whining about it would get some perspective. They simply refuse to do so.
We've had (11) All American (the measuring stick I'm using for "elite) DT's since Bob Devaney arrived.
5 of those guys were from Nebraska or border states:
Larry Jacobsen '71 - South Dakota
John Dutton '73 - South Dakota
Mike Fultz '76 - Lincoln
Jim Skow '85 - Omaha
Danny Noonan '86 - Lincoln
6 we're from greater distances away:
Wayne Meylan '66,'67 - Michigan
Rich Glover '71,'72 - New Jersey
Neil Smith '87 - Louisianna
Jason Peter '97 - New Jersey
Suh '09 - Oregon
You might guess that after Rich Glover, as great an inside player as we've ever had playing on a National Championship team, that we would have had guys flocking from all over the country to play tackle at Nebraska. Well, the next A.A. defensive tackle we had that wasn't from Nebraska or South Dakota was Neil Smith, 15 years later!
Even after back to back NC's with a Hall of Fame DT like Glover (and Jacobsen) on the team, we still weren't a big draw for DT's from outside our immediate area.
During our great run in the 90's, when even if we weren't winning NC's, we were still damn good, we had 1 All American DT the whole decade.
We had 2 All American DT's that weren't from Nebraska or South Dakota during the entire Tom Osborne era.
So, will people please get real about how well we should be doing in recruiting top flight DT's from who knows where to play at Nebraska. We have never had a history of doing so.
If you think that Pelini should be out-performing the likes of Devaney and Osborne in this area, and that if he doesn't do so he sucks, then go right ahead. You're entitled to your opinion, despite how little perspective you may have.
Richie Glover................ uv uf Calming sauve for the wound.
Wow, those stats make it look like we've done pretty damn good over time. You still have to dig into it a bit though.
Prior to Suh in 2009, our most previous A.A. at DT was Peter is 1997, 12 years earlier. You have to go back '85-'87 before that when we kind of had a bonanza with Skow, Noonan, and Smith in 3 consecutive years. You could argue that was the end of an era, where we had (9) All American DT's in a 21 year period dating back to 1966. I would have to admit, that's pretty impressive. I guess we were kind of Defensive Tackle University in those days, thanks largely to the local guys. We had (5) All American DT's from Nebraska or South Dakota between 1973-1987.
Unfortunately, we've only had (2) All American DT's in the last 25 years, and as they say, the more recent the history, the more relevant it is. They were both from long distances (Suh, Peter). We haven't had a "local" A.A. at the position since Danny Noonan in 1986.
I bow to your stats on the other schools. I would have thought they had out done us, but my take on the matter is largely unaffected. We haven't recruited elite DT's well in the past 25 years and we haven't had any local guys of that caliber in that time span either. Based on your stats above, even elite teams don't recruit A.A. caliber DT's on a regular basis.
There's just not that many of these guys to go around, and the center of the college football world has shifted away from us. We are more challenged than ever to get them here, and we haven't gotten them here with any frequency the last 25 years anyway.
This post was edited by TheUnknownFan 15 months ago
I might upvote everything you say. Every one of us would love to pull 2 or 3 5 star defensive tackles out of the south, but people need a little perspective. Too many people are clueless on how we have built teams in the past. Look at the last 5 years, Mack Brown has pulled better classes then Osborne EVER did. How has that turned out for him?
"FUNDAMENTALS ARE A CRUTCH FOR THE TALENTLESS".
- KENNY POWERS
Excellent content. I think the broader point would be to look at the level of DT recruits we had coming in during the 1990s and where those kids came from. Not sure if I would feel better if we had a 4* kid not amount to much or a 2* kid not amount to much. The recruiting rating process is overrated to some extent. It certainly helps to get elite talent but the number of elite players that miss in a major way is quite high. I would like to swing for the fences and miss with the player. But it isn't like Bo and Co. are not offering and recruiting the elite DTs -- those kids just haven't been interested. We need to focus on developing what we got and quite whining about the kids that passed on us. If Nebraska fails to recruit a kid within 250-500 miles and he turns out to be a complete stud, then gripe all you like. But whining that Nebraska cannot pull the 5* DT from DC, Cali, or any southern state seems rather futile and pointless.
I see tuf decided to take this thread in another direction. 1 thing is getting AA, another is getting capable, pretty good players that can play your system, rather than a 2 star from a area of Florida that doesn't produce much D1 talent.
This pick up is much more of a WKU recruit than a Nebraska OSu michigan Texas Bama recruit.
No attempt to hijack, Lando. Link stated "why can't we land a big time DT"? I interpret that as a 4*, potential All American type player, not just a role player. That's why I went down that road.
I tend to agree with you about the recent DT commit, but he may pan out in time. I think Moss and Valentine are going to be better players than anyone thought during their recruitment. You really can't tell much at this point.
Speaking of "playing in your system", I'm hearing a little scuttle about a shift in defensive philosophy for the future. Hearing any of that yourself?
Some really good info you had there TUF. Hopefully this will put an end to all the talk about not being able to recruit top DT prospects. I mean if Devaney and T.O. couldn't do it on a regular basis how are we to expect Bo to do it. Nebraska has never needed to "Top" prospects to be successful its all about developing the guys we have. That is what has made Nebraska stand out among the other football powerhouses. Like someone stated above about Mack Brown...he has had the pick of the litter of the best talent in Texas for years and how has that worked out for them? We have been successful during Pelini's tenure so far we just have to be able to get over the proverbial "hump" and I believe we are only a few pieces from doing so.
TUF, just speculating here cause I haven't done the research, but I would imagine that 3 or 4 of that 11 weren't "elite" recruits (hard to define from the 60s-80s), but developed into "elite" AAs during their time in Lincoln.
Can you describe further what you heard?
FYI, major upvote here. Factual research is always helpful in these conversations.
Well written TUF
TUF, you made this thread worthwhile imo. Given the players we currently have I think they'd have to be willing to tweak the system so they can be successful. I also put a great deal of stock into what Kaz was saying about recruiting. I think they know that they can't afford to "pass" on talent because it doesn't fit their system. Take the talent and fit the system. And as for the 5 * obsession, I still think you try for them but fill the class first and hold out for one or two of them so you aren't self-imposing scholly limits. Anyway, great work on the historical perspective.
Nebraska's had top prospects in the past but they were always a product of N's identity. RB, option QB, and some O-line here and there. WR was few and far between. The lions share of elite prospects were on D. DE, LB typically. In the 90's there were more DB's and DT was really just sprinkled in. Many times those guys were developed.
N absolutely recruited elite talent but there was an evolution there and that was why TO developed the system he did. He took advantage of what N and border states had to offer and picked his battles on the "elite" guys.
I imagine you are exactly right. Can't tell you how some of those guys from way back when were evaluated during the recruiting season.
I can tell you this. The following 4 guys we're all rated 4 stars coming out of high school:
Todd Peat jr.
Suh turned out to be an all time great.
Rome has spent more time on his back than a flop house ho.
Peat jr. thought he could become a BCS caliber tackle by playing xBox instead of working out.
The stars only mean so much to begin with.
This isn't an open and shut case or as easy an argument as anyone wants to make it.
DT is one the hardest positions to recruit or project in all of college football. As with OL, the guys that end up playing FBS AQ level football at these positions were typically the biggest and baddest bullies on the field in High School. Pretty much all of them were dominant at whatever level of High School football they played.
The ones that really get noticed are the ones that go to camps and compete in the Nike, Sparq, and other types of events around the country. People get to see how these guys interact with other big guys of their physical nature and these are the guys that get the stars and high ratings. But even then, the drills that are done at these camps don't really tell even half the story, and we see a number of busts at this position from highly rated players.
What about a Terrence Cody who was a little known 3* JUCO DT that Alabama pulled out of the woodworks of Mississippi that they turned into a 2 time All-American DT? This is a kid that has struggled mightily with weight problems his entire life. Only Saban and his staff have been able to keep his weight, and his spectacular play, under control.
What about Jerel Worthy? The All Big 10 DT from Michigan State last year that became a 2nd round draft pick of the Green Bay Packers? We tried to recruit him, and he was merely a low end 3 star kid out of high school.
Since Bo has been here, we have recruited solid talent to the position. Before this years class we had recruited 9 guys in 5 years. 10 including Baker Steinkuhler:
Baker Steinkuhler - 5 * (NE)
Quentin Toailoa - 3* (CA)
Cole Pensick - 3* (NE - moved to OL)
Thad Randle - 3* (TX)
Jay Guy - 3* (CA)
Chase Rome - 4* (MO)
Todd Peat - 4* (AZ)
Kevin Williams - 3* (OH)
Aaron Curry - 3* (TX)
Vincent Valentine - 3* (IL)
Is 10 guys over 5 years enough at this all-important position? These were all talented kids coming out of High School. Not a bad offer in any of them.
We can make all the excuses we want, but we are in a bad position at DT rolling into next year. We are possibly looking at 2 RS Fr playing siginificant minutes at this position and zero upper-classmen that look as if they can compete for All Big 10 honors, much less 2nd team.
Our own DL coach said we needed 2 JUCO DTs that could come in and contribute THIS YEAR. He even said it wasn't for depth reasons, but to contribute. His own words, not mine. And this was all of about a week ago.
If a coach on the staff is making a comment like this, and we don't land 2 JUCO DTs that can come in and produce, where does that put us at this all-important position? If you aren't scared about DT next year, then I want some of what you are drinking.
Would you guys stop talking so much and just let me look at the girls????
This speaks to why you must sign numbers as there are going to be a number of players who don't pan out for one reason or another.
It's good to be the King.
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